David Lynch [SPAMMED]
Cinema, Television and Media World
Absent or broken pic
Cinema, Television and Media World
Absent or broken pic
#idlebody. He's a clear self-preserving 4w5. ''Self-Pres Fours are particularly sensitive to comfort issues—the temperature of a room, the quality of the lighting, the humidity or lack of it, the weather—all produce powerful emotional responses. Self-Pres Fours become frustrated that the environment is insufficiently attuned to their personal needs.'' He seems very sensitive to these kind of things, from ruining a relationship because he couldn't stand the smell of cooking food, to cofee and the same meal. But also in his art, such as enjoying to sleep on the sets of Eraserhead or saying he wants to bite his pictures. He's very sensitive to how the environment feels around him, and I don't see much envy directed to the social sphere or intimates, like for example, from Kurt Cobain (sx/sp).
#Zeego, It has to do with how people see the world differently, so don't know; World-View Personality Types? Anyway, the main thing with a system like MBTI is to eliminate inconsistencies or convoluted explanations, as long as it does the person typed justice. As such, there still remains a problem with being sure that people like Lynch, Tarkovsky, Oshii are Intuitives, even agreeing that any type can be good with aesthetics: Stanley Kubrick. Isn't Kubrick way too similar with these people to say he's S but the other N. Either Kubrick is indeed NT and then all contemplative directors are N types, or Kubrick is ISTP and everyone else remains in doubt. Like I said, less inconsistency as possible provided we make the person justice, and Kubrick is that inconsistency here. But what do we make of Kubrick? If he was INTJ, that would explain his resourcefulness as a J quality, but we seemed to agree on Ti-dom. #idlebody, What do you think of Kubrick?
A good way to differentiate ISFP from an NF type is to examine what the artist's intentions are. An ISFP artist's work is not so much about finding hidden meanings, it's about how the viewer or audience experiences the artistic creation as delineated through the five senses. The ISFP's work questions "What does this song/film make you feel? Does it make you want to punch someone in the face? Does it make you want to dance? Does it make you horny? Does it make you want to laugh or cry?" That's how an ISFP approaches their creations. An xNFJ or xNFP is more interested in hidden meanings, their approach is more "This has a personal meaning for me, I want others to interpret this in their own way to find their own meaning". This is why I get annoyed when people type guys like David Lynch or David Bowie as ISFP, because NF artists are interested in searching for hidden meanings through abstraction. They're not at all interested in concrete ideas.
Makes sense. Btw, do you have an official name yet for the "dreamer-aesthete thingy", as you called it?
Hi Bonita! I don't see what the last part of your comment has to do with the rest. But yes, I have a problem differentiating INFPs from INFJs and ISFPs lately. After thinking I get to some clarity on this, it all failed apart. #Zeego, Yeah, I also know this, the thing is with the hands-on approach and resoursfulness a director like Lynch or Kubrick need to have. Don't know, I'm so confused lately on this issue, I have no idea why can't I just leave this behind and focus on my personal dreamer-aesthete thingy I tried to do as to individualize my own personality types.
bobnickmad should refrain from voting and commenting because he has no fucking clue how to differentiate ISFPs from INFPs, and he knows this. Over and over he makes the same mistake; get a job already!
David Lynch main insterest is ze mind! Intuitive FFFFF FFFFF SSSSSSSSSSSSS
Seriously though, why do we keep coming back to this "tertiary Ni" idea when we keep invalidating the theory of function stacks over and over? We seem to go in circles with this.
I don't think it makes sense to type Lynch as an S simply because he's good with aesthetics. His films are full of abstractions and "strangeness" that pervade any sense of realism, and in interviews he always seems like a head-in-the-clouds type.
The thing with a guy like Lynch or Kubrick is that they were very practical at the lowest level -cinematography- which helped them great movies with amazing cinematography (2001, Eraserhead) much cheaper than many others would have. I feel lately that this separation in 4 letters is not apropiate in a way, since many of geniuses strenghts seems their ability in being good on aspects that are seen as dichtotomies. Like Kubrick or Lynch, and probably the greatest of movie-makers seems to have succeded because they have both strong S and N characteristics: S because they're good at the lowest levels -light, sound, texture, interior design etc., N because the way they take this projects into this mind-blowing creations that stretch the limits of their genre and tend to be contemplative people. So, if we would type them best what they excel at, Lynch would be S-N-F while Kubrick S-N-T, which makes them better justice than typing them S or N.
I guess my final vote for David is INFP. Because like David, Russell Brand also practices transcendental meditation and despite Russell being ENFP, he managed to develop his Ni through that. I suppose it's possible that David developed his Ni through that as well.
@bobnickmad Hmm, yeah David's a confusing guy. Because on the one hand, he talks about introverted intuition quite a lot. He also demonstrates introverted feeling. But what confuses me is that I have never seen an ISFP 5w4 before. INFP 5w4 on the other hand I'd be more willing to believe. Also this quote by him strikes me as very INFx: "It makes me uncomfortable to talk about meanings and things. It's better not to know so much about what things mean. Because the meaning, it's a very personal thing, and the meaning for me is different than the meaning for somebody else." - David Lynch.
Plus, when you realize that Mulholland Dr. is what happens when one watches Sunset Boulevard and Persona several times in his life, its no longer such a mysterious movie, albeit a masterfully executed one in terms of atmosphere.
ISFP valuing Ni, after all the interviews I read and watched with him. I know it's weird but it's the only think that seems to fit after all this time. He's about sensory impressions and what he feels about them, with a strong but inarticulate interest in Ni. He talks about ideas, but he doesn't talk ideas. A Ni-dom would talk about concepts and archetypes in their work instead of rambling on and on how ''ideas are a beautiful thing'' and never getting anywhere like he read it in a book but never got after the first chapter. He's inarticulate both in Feeling (like in the Charlie Rose interview, Charlie Rose is Fe and it's easy to see the awkwardness in that interview) and Intuition, instead he's very good at explaining how sounds and textures or comparing sounds and textures etc. There's a the fact that he's an obviously gifted person, which makes it more likely to have several functions strongly developed, thus more likely an ISFP with strong Ni then an INFJ with poor Fe and even poorer Ti. (As evidence of his poor capacity to explain the emotions in his movies or the ideas in it, but his varied impressions of sensorial impressions he collects) #idlebody, If you want to type every interesting person as a Ni-dom, fine. Personally I feel pretty dissatisfied with MBTI right now, as it's hard to see where projection starts and ends. He's similar with Bob Dylan and Chino Moreno from Deftones in the sense that sensorial impression suggests surrealistic images but those images are valued for their quality as images and not much more.
You'll never see an INFJ call strangers "Friends", only a naive INFP.
Also, if you go on David Lynch's twitter and if you replace "Dear Twitter Friends" with "Diane", you'll realize that his Twin Peaks character Dale Cooper is essentially based on himself.
INFJ 5w4 so/sx. He's one of the more outgoing fives. He's not your typical reclusive hermit 5w4 such as Scott Walker. The collective consciousness (social instinct) is very important to him. He's interested in society as a whole, sending out tweets on his twitter wanting to know what and how everyone is doing. He has inferior sensing as he's not really the type to cook or clean for himself. He enjoys habitual behaviors and routines (like eating the same meal every day for months) that allow him to free his mind to think about other things (Ni+Ti).
#segovois, there are people here who troll with modified names of original users, please do not delete the original users. butterrfly=/=buterfly. remember
Gregory House' discussion havn't be deleted, i jude hid te page. We i'll have time, i'll fix it
<p>Spammer Congratulation!</p> <p>Achievement Unlocked: "Wanker of the Year".</p> <p>Reward: Free lube and a bag full of dildos. Enjoy!</p
Site admin visited us today and deleted the Gregory House page. Apparently that's all he did and left. It would've been better if he transferred some more powers to mods, maybe power to delete filthy things. @bobnickmad: sorry that was my fault. I didn't think of it. I thought that if spam votes can't be deleted than whole page should be deleted and re-added. I don't think that would work though..
I've seen that you could delete all the comments on House's page and did a rework on the recent comments section. I would like to know who you are as you have stronger powers.
Ok, who the hell wrote Delete in the title? It's pretty obvious is spammed like many entries. Does this means delete all the discussion here as well? That's moronic.
In the 4 function+2 axis model he could only be ISFP, but I find it as a very unsatisfying model. I think it's more important that he's interested in what lies behind the way things appear that is N over S, than Se or Ni aesthetics. For one, I find the music he makes very Ne in aesthetic, but I think any can like whatever style of aesthetics they like, it's more a matter of personal taste. ISFP can use Ni, but it's decorative (like with Klimt), Mulholland Dr. deals with how dreams are formed in the last part and Eraserhead is all N in aesthetic. For me INFP is Fi-Ne-(Ni)-(Ti)-(Fe)-Si-(Se)-Te. ISFP is Fi-Se-(Si)-(Ti)-(Fe)-Ni-(Ne)-Te, if you're interested in my typing logic. I don't claim to have the truth on the matter, but the four function models leads to overtly-convoluted explanations and ignores half of someone's functions. My only addition is the separation into clouded and unclouded function. Basically, since Ni is usually clouded by Ne, it tends to not show at the surface of most INFPs, but is actually an important part of their psyche, it's just its domain is limited and put to serve Ne. It generally helps INFP them unify their subjective Fi impressions into some world-view and visualize their dream-worlds. In an INFP that's into visual arts, Ni is more useful so it can be more obvious than a INFP who's not into visual arts.
Yeah, INFP spamming. Now I see 6 votes, but there were more earlier. His aesthetics and humor is very Se and Ni so I would guess ISFP or INFJ. And after Eraserhead he is a picture of 6w5 to me.
Someone is spamming! A lot of votes in a few minutes! Anyway, I guess IxFP pr INFJ.
I find it uber suspicious that INFJ is winning here looooool
''pretentious movie director and Danish movie industry culture (note Lars von Trier's douchy Fe) '' Something's rotten in Denmark indeed !
And also like I'm trying to see all the "important movies", going through lists of books, etc. I feel like I see that more often in other INFPs than INFJs who tend to be more idiosyncratic.
Yeah, I think so! I've noticed a lot of Tertiary Si artist when they get older, will suddenly do these detail-heavy works like Christopher Nolan's upcoming historical war film, David Cronenberg's on Jung/Freud, etc. >.<
Btw #butterfly, do you think being nerdy like that on a specific topic is a sign of tertiary Si. I guess Se users can be obsessive too, but over Se-ish things like sport or martial arts, but just randomly spouting fact about personal interests at people that don't want to hear it, it's kinda tertiary Si, no? (bobnickmad, random fact collect, lol! )
I want to make movies so girls would obsess over me on internet forums. #life goal
You can wait. I think that after The Neon Demon, he's done with her.
Next discussion topic, do you guys think it would be evil for me to actively try to break up Winding Refn's marriage or do I need to just patiently wait :(
Well, to be fair - in my last post I was arguing that the elements of Neon Demon that thedude calls "sick Se" or something is in fact general Fi. But my general argument about Winding Refn is wackiness (Ne) and earnestness/always-following-his-heart (Fi). He's also slightly out of balance (Inferior Te) - though I think a lot of that is also a sort of Ne-based impression of a pretentious movie director and Danish movie industry culture (note Lars von Trier's douchy Fe) -- and he is a sack of potatoes (Si).
I understand. For the record, I love his work prior to Drive.
When he says that Mikkelsen is an airhead, that's like when I call Shane Carruth lazy or something. It's Ne+Te. Also it's obviously an ongoing joke between Mikkelsen and Winding Refn which the interviewer is consciously referring to with his choice of words. According to Mikkelsen, Winding Refn is a complete nerd you can't discuss anything but movies with. https://youtu.be/aFbrvPGvA34?t=4m36s And I'm definitely not saying any INFP is going to like Nicolas Winding Refn movies nor necessarily trying to convince you of his work's qualities, I'm just trying to point to some of things I think are going on in the movie, suggestive of his particular INFP-ness. With my description I was not trying to suggest his movie are "deep" or original, but playful/wacky (Ne) and that the ideas seem to come before the images. To some degree I think it's *really* supposed to be a horror movie for 16 year old girls. It deals with subjects that are important to that group, and it attacks authority - which Winding Refn imagines teens like though he can't possible be serious that he thinks he has done this in an appealing way (Ne). Basically it's just a very strange and (at least to me it seems) earnest pop-culture weirdness artifact with no compromises for almost no one.
Don't have much to say about Refn. Only watched Drive, which I really liked for being a simple story executed in a careful way with superb visuals. If I would type the movie itself it would be ISP, but don't know Refn himself. I find Refn full of himself and unplesant as a person. I don't find that much depth in the things Butterfly say about Refn. I mean ''hero origin story'', why is that so interesting? It's pretty cliched stuff. And making a movie about the ''cruelty'' and ''shallowness'' of the beauty industry is one of the most cliche things ever. In a way it's good Lynch would rather not talk about that stuff. At least, Mulholland Dr. was a very human story, masterfully executed, and the weirdness actually gave weight to the characters drama. Look, only because I type this people ISP, it doesn't mean their movie aren't meaningful. Fi-dominance and Ti-dominance in itself deals with either value judgements or story logic, which is enough to gave a movie ''meaning'', even when it's not explored in a Ne way. Like there's this thing about innocence and how it can turn to its dark-side in Lynch movies (Blue Velvet, Mulholland: the main characters start as innocent people, yet their curiosity/sensitivity turn to voyeurism+adultery/crime), or people not escaping from their conscious (Lost Highway, Mulholland, is about people escaping their guilty conscious inside their minds yet it all unravels bit by bit from inside) which in itself carries importance, because Fi itself weight those things. Meanwhile, ISTPs like Kubrick deal with some of the logical implications the story, another type would pass over, because Ti itself weight those things. I guess, by comparison ISPs are more focused, while INPs are more exploratory. And IMO, by comparison, those things of alleged depth Refn says seem pretty shallow and empty intellectualism, probably because he's such a self-centered individual. Or maybe he has some interesting points to make, but it ruins it with cheap shock value, sort of like Marlyin Manson. At the same time, Lynch doesn't explain things in a very Ne way, I mean he talks ABOUT ideas, rather than talking ideas. I don't expect a Ne user to talk about his movie means, but rather to talk about various things starting from the movie, yet Lynch just dwelves in this mystical cliches.
He says he separates movies and family. "I try to keep things very divided". that seems very Te. About Mikkelsen "it's like speaking to an airhead". I find it agressive. The way he puts out his emotions lacks the subtlety of an INFP IMO. And it feels fake. I could see him as a very disturbed Fi dom with backfiring Te. But I still see The Neon Demon as the assertion of shallow Se, not Ne. I don't see the moralistic aspects you're referring to. It feels superficial (and it is asserted) to me. I went to see The Neon Demon with my INFP friend, and she was disgusted and impressed at how bad she thought the film was, so that's not an INFP thing as you would like to see it, but just your own take on Refn. I'd still like to see Bob's opinion on Refn now.
I started watching from about 16 minutes in and I didn't see any insults? He even says something like that Mads Mikkelsen is one of the greatest actors in the world and that he was lucky to work with him? Also notice how he's constantly talking about his family and analyzing which actors he relates to and doesn't, basically like me and bobnickmad are constantly doing on this site, lol. He actually seems unusually INFP at the place you pointed me to. As for The Neon Demon, it's one of my favorite experiences of 2016, movies and not. Imo it's not very Se at all, but an almost moralistic fairy tale. It takes superficial beauty so far that at the end, it's has become something gruesome and disgusting. When the dedication to Winding Refn's wife comes and Sia starts singing about the voices in her head that tell her to treat herself better, I can actually believe in it because Winding Refn has told in his own extremely personal way and insulted the establishment every way he could on the way. He even has one character turn a running garden hose in the direction of the camera for a moment, as if he is peeing at the audience.^^ How upset you are may better be explained by Winding Refn having cut the throat of Fe to achieve Fi.
I find Refn agressive, and The Neon Demon is the worst film I've seen in theaters. Ever. To me it feels like self absorbed Se, like De Palma, possessed by his obsessions. It was gross. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7xhdtq9N90 Watch this interview about 16', the way he insults Mads Mikkelsen, the most un-INFP behavior.
I think Winding Refn, in a way, is Lynch up-side down a lot of the time. He has ideas which look like images rather than images that look like ideas, if that makes any sense. For example in portraying what it feels like to encounter a foreign culture, he created some very bizarre images (Valhalla Rising), and in trying to convey frustration at going too far about superficial beauty, he creates some really horrific, fascinating images (Neon Demon), etc., etc. A very concrete example is the Scorpion image which is sort of the Drive guy's superhero suit. It's an image ... But it's very idea-based - "doing a realistic superhero origin story". I think a lot about Winding Refn's strangeness can be explained by him being an INFP with dyslexia, which forces him to get out in the world and express himself physically. I also think what Bobnickmad was saying about INFP vs. ISFP anger fits with Winding Refn who is more someone who looks like he is about to blow up at any moment than genuinely, naturally aggressive. >.< Also just in general the way he phrases himself, being a sack of potatoes, etc., etc. it all points towards INFP imo, though opposite to Lynch one could perhaps say mundanely he is an I-S-F-P.
You make me want to change votes for both Lynch and Refn as ISFP.
Anyway, I guess every artistic type can start from some sudden image, but an IN would translate those images in ideas, while an ISFP would just use them for their direct effect (such as an industry based on using people heads to make pencils and other stuff, as opposed to just making pencils form people's heads). And by that token, you could say Lynch is more image driven, than idea driven. Yet, compared to your average ISFP, his images are more influenced by his unconscious. Maybe that Transcendental Meditation really works after all ! I mean, you could claim that by letters he's I-N-F-P, but he seems more in touch with Se than Ne.
Coming back to him, while in my system he's one of the more ''intuitive'' types: Dreamer-Aesthete, I think in the 4 function model he's still more Fi-Se-Ni-Te than Fi-Ne-Si-Te. I saw a video behind the scenes of his movie Inland Empire, and there was a moment where he got really angry at someone not doing something right, and he was quite scary. Of course, I'm not saying INFPs can't be scary in a lower Te moment, but I think INFP would be more of an ''I think he might break down'' type of anger, while he had this very casual but also very imposing kind of anger. Really unpleasant and didn't expect it, yet he started laughing right after that. I think that's more inferior Te + Se than Te + Ne. As I understand, Se users can get very angry and scary suddenly, and just as suddenly cool down, while Si users come of as less scary in the moment but takes them more time to cool off, as if Si users are a storm passing by while Se users are a thunder.
I saw Van Gogh in the INFP heaven.
I also realized that in order to remain consistent to my system, I have to change Van Gogh to an ISFP (aesthete-dreamer). He was more tied to reality, he painted stuff that was there in reality and only use his strong imagination for aesthetic purpose.
Anyway, I'm trying to develop my own personal ''system'', based on MBTI but not tied to the functions (except the dominant and inferior). This guy is what I call a ''Dreamer-Aesthete''. Dreamer I associate most with INFP, and Aesthete with ISFP, so I vote him INFP overall. Dreamers are people for which imagination and dreams have more appeal than simple every-day life, they have the feeling that another world, more exciting exists somewhere beneath the reality of this world and the mind can bring it to life.They can deal with escapism, questioning whether one can escape in the fantasy in their mind from the banality of the world, such works that deal with this include Mulholland Dr. and End of Evangelion. The Dreamer-Aesthete has very developed and personal aesthetic taste, with which through visuals, sounds and moods, they try to bring their reality to life.Other Dreamer-Aesthetes include Tim Burton, Charles Baudelaire and Hideaki Anno.
INFP, because for him what matters is to infuse life with the quality of dreams, his movies are basically dreams presented in a way that they can be comprehended while not losing their dream quality.An ISFP would be an aesthete dedicated to reality.INFPs are aesthete that try to break the conventions of reality through imagination.
Yet his brainyquotes sound (scream) lighthearted but also deep INFP: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/d/david_lynch.html
Ethics is not restricted to Fi. It's actually a bad example, as many INFJ writers (Dostoievski, Mishima etc.) are obsessed with the idea of murder and ethics. Lost Highway was written with Barry Gifford and what inspired Lynch with OJ is not ethics at all, it's the state fugue, how a man can escape in fantasies refusing to accept his crime. There are no deep conscious ethical messages with Lynch's work as you would imply.
Routine or not I think you need to look at other things to know if he was a J, in this case an INFJ (Ni-dom) as your theory. I was watching this vid on YT about Lost Highway and he said that he was inspired/obsessed by the OJ Simpson case and the horror that implies to live with that. That point towards a care for ethics (Fi). I've also read before about his concern about the bad stuff he shows in his movies. So there's a strong message behind.
However, seeing as how he is very structured in his everyday life, maybe he isn't really inferior in Te. It actually seems like Ti that he represses the most. Hmm... I can NOT see him as an Fe-dom though.
He does seem to have that inferior rejected Te thing going on, which would make sense for an INFP.
I see his function strength as something like: Ni > Fi > Fe > Ne > Se > Si > Ti > Te, and it all comes down to trying to come up with one type that best represents him which is very difficult.
Well, I see stronger Ni than Fi, and no Te so he can't be INTJ, leaving INFJ as the best option, although INFP comes in 2nd place.
He can't be INFJ because he has too much Fi, widely shown in his movies. Read his quotes on brainyquote; it screams INFP 4w5. His Ne is strong too. Ni is the most difficult part to talk about; theories of strong Ni in INFPs. He can't be ISFP because his movies are too complex. But to me he has lived dark, strong and genuine Ni, which he shows in his movies but he's not comfortable with that because he's an INFP after all. Lynch persona is not dark at all. "reliable, responsible and conscientious. He is also apparently extremely polite and mature" INFPs are like that when they work with other people, the healthy ones; responsible above all.
He even seems weirder alongside actual ISFPs though. Actually just read Debaser's comments at the bottom of the page. I think they makes INFJ very clear. He does have Ni but it is a strong Ni.
*(Fi-Si), on my INFP list, to another
That's a good point #hello to, I also tought this, but he excelled at the SP side of movie creation with Eraserhead, and like I said, and he alwayes felt off to me despite being close in type, enneagram and instinct. #butterfly won me here, but you can still save yourself.
*unusual high range, 3) Related to 2., I liked the idea of having this guy on my INFP but he always weird to me among the others.And I guess is because I can't see myself having a fluent conversation with this guy.We have such different way of comunicating things, I would like to go from one point to anothet and put high ideas in simple terms (Ne) maybe referencincing how I feel inside(Fi-Se), he would stay in place but combine oddly specific impresions with mysterious expressions (Se-Ni). He would likely be interesting to listen to but I don't see myself chatting easily with him.Overall, he seems like a really bizzare ISFP, someone expressing himself through sensory language yet really bizzare likes, and with some Ni aura of mysyery his enneagram 4 likes to accentuate (it always felt to me he likes being seen as weird, similar with Manson).
I also changed to 4w5 sp/sx.
Did you read what I wrote below, bobnickmad?
Butterfly wins this one! Sorry those who trusted me! I still can't explain the Eraserhead thing but I came to agree on ISFP on 3 main motives from reading writen interviews and stuff: 1) He was very hands on, 'artisan' (SP) with making Eraserhead. It was a cheap movie but he build the props manually.When asked how he achieved those effects with so litle money he said it's about how things are lighten in front of the camera.It's amazing that such a visually impressive movie was made with low budget, but Lynch managed it because he got involved with building props and had an instinctive eye for light and shadows.Very much like Kubrick, he was a true 'artisan' , not just someone with ideas, his later movies were more expensive yet less ambitious because he lacked time and control. Also, while filming Eraserhead he enjoyed...building sheds, for real, he was actually building sheds. Apparently he liked building stuff from an young age. When he says he likes "going into strange worlds you build" he means it literary. He also said he started making films to see his paintings moving. I also get the impression he likes his 'paintings' for the materials he uses to make them more than anything, and they're Francis Bacon worship anyway. 2) A type excells in comunicating their main extroverted functions. FJ are verbally emotionally articulated (not this guy), NP are good at putting complex ideas in simple terms, not really him either. He mostly doesn't go into philosopical generalties and when he does he explains it in a mysterious way, like the fact that a script is made from ideas sounds like a religious thing from him. What I found he has an aptitude for, is explaining textures and sensations from other sensory elements, yet he's still the world strangest ISFP: he's fascinated by the textures of ducks, hairless rats, band aids (?). I tought this was bizzare Si but he's weirdly specific about how things feel to him, in a way that I'm just not. I monitor my internal moods (Fi-Si) but he seems to have an usual high range of descriptions for sounds, tactile and visual sensations.He can pinpoint the sounds he wants in movies in such peculiar yet to him specific ways.Laura Harring also said he has a very visual way of explaining things, or another actor about how he gives instructions like "you have a plastic bag on your face" to explain what he wants from him.And apparently he forms many of his 'ideas' from sounds.In fact Blue Velvet's plot seems mainly driven by ideas who's values serves in settingba mood (songs, ears, ants, clothes etc.). His main ability lies in knowing how particular sensations feel like, not articulating abstract ideas or relatable emotions. His obsesion with 'ideas' and 'dreams' is probably a fascination to a 3rd Ni he likes diving in but still feels like weird teritory, his obsesion with Transcendental Mediation is likely a fascination with tertiary Ni.
I just discovered why Lynch makes those quick and strange gestures with one hand when he's talking; he's trying to explain the dark and unexplainable (genuine Ni). Him being an INFP has access to Ni in 6th place, so it's strong (theory) but it's not natural to him. INFPs create Ni through strong Fi+Ne fueled by Si (theory, don't quote me). But Lynch because of X event(s) in his life knows what genuine Ni means and has scared him for life; that Ni is what he's trying to show you in his movies.
Butterfly is way too lazy for something like that!! I have been thinking more about what you said about being inspired to make the red room after touching a car though, and I'm actually starting to think that's not a very Ne thing. Think about it this way: What was it really that he imagined? He saw a red car and he imagined a red room. Where are the ideas? It's something sensory (Se) that in a lightbulb moment perhaps (Ni) leads to something else sensory. If Lynch was an INFP I imagine he would have come at it in a different way, in terms of what the red room is supposed to mean, etc. or from some kind of mixing of ideas. When I make up wacky stuff, at least, that's how it works. But the meaning of the red room doesn't really matter much to Lynch, I think. It's just the weird way it makes you feel and how mysterious it is. It probably just struck him what a weird effect a room covered in this color would have. I also have an ISFP friend, and she actually loves everything off-beat. Like when I'm reading some really abstract book or when I was studying philosophy, she had me tell her about it, being the only really patient Sensor listener of my friends on this subject, and she was always awfully amused by it. I can imagine an ISFP going down in the direction that they sort of decide to make their art about this type of amusement. Does this make any sense? Lynch is not going to actually interact that much with the ideas behind it, but he plays with the moods and sensation of this weirdness. Perhaps it's precisely because Lynch only cares about the surface of it that he was able to make it as a surrealist (!) in Hollywood. I just have a really hard time making sense of Lynch as a INFP and especially INFJ. With ISFP all the parts fit and there are no too big problems imo; it's just kind of surprising, that is all.
Honestly, the more interviews I read the more ISFP makes much sense than INFJ. He's all about textures, moods, visual contrasts, nothing Ni-Fe about the guy. Yet, I still finds his ideas too weird and non-linear for an ISFP ( a kid growing a benevolent grandmother from a seed?), plus that he puts ideas above everything in interviews, alongside his very subjective, non-Fe personal feeling tones, so Fi+Intuition over sensation would make most sense.I just wanted to say that there's a stronger case for ISFP like Butterfly made than some people seem to believe, it's my second choice after INFP, far above INFJ right now.Btw, I wonder if Butterfly started looking for paintings that could have influenced Eraserhead?
I mean, don't type them.
Gifted people are difficult to type.
Fix my english pls
Sofia Coppola is an INFP wannabe.
ISFPs like Sofia Coppola
About how his inspiration works: before making Eraserhead he wanted to make "Gardenback was a surrealist script about adultery which featured a continually growing insect representing one's man's lust for his neighbor." So you can see the weird stuff in his movie is not meaningless like you seem to imply. "In its place, Lynch presented Eraserhead, which he had developed based on a daydream of a man's head taken to a pencil factory by a small boy." So from day-dreams he takes his inspiration, daydreadms which seem way too weird for a non N type. Or how he imagined The Red Room from a warm red car.I can't imagine Se-Ni jumping connections like that: warm car -- surrealist roim, with only the color red in common.I imagine stuff like that often. Like I was in school, and I saw this piece of metal in my mind there appeared this full image of a grey alien ocean, with black towers that were populated by unseen organism, and there were this red dots floating around, and all this, the ocean, the towers seemed organic. I'm a 495 trytipe which is consider very imaginative, Lynch is probably 459 or something, but I can't imagine the trytipe making someone's daydreams so surreal without a clear preference for Intuition over Sensation. I imagine creative SPs being more hands-on material where their sensibilities about the fits in the material based on their sensibilities and modyfying till it all fits to their liking. Like Kubrick's more original works were based on books which he modified untill they matched his personal likes and dislikes while adding stuff that accentiate certain aspects of a scene.But Lynch talks only about ideas and how thet attract each other.So you have this very strange movie that started from this very strange day dream. Also, in interviews he has this aerian, alien like aura about him that INFx have, and you can't fake this but you can fake 'badass', compare with ISFPs like Coppola, they're more earthy.There's a cameo he did in Twin Peaks where he talks about cofee and he seems more outer-wordly than Copper himself who's INFJ, and he just plays himself. But anyway, my main arguments are how he started Eraserhead from a bizzare day dream and that his movies aren't 'meaningless' as you seem to take, rather their meaning is more personal.
As for Lynch, I'm still unsure between INFP and INFJ, but I don't really see ISFP in him. I think he's just one of those people who's hard to type and has a lot of highly-developed functions.
butterfly: "We have INFJs as weird as Lars von Trier and Marilyn Manson, who upset people on purpose. Couldn't there theoretically be ISFJs like this? What would an artistic, anti-social ISFJ look like?" *cough* Andy Warhol *cough*
@bobnickmad: I meant my contrarian, weird typings! I think Miyazaki and Mann are pretty uncontroversial, lol. I didn't know I'd actually swayed you with Gaiman. :) Anyway, you have actually swayed me. Like Saint-Exupéry being INFJ and George Orwell being INFP. Anyway, I think creative processes vary for everyone of course, but I have the impression ISFPs tend to be copyists (through Se). Like George Lucas using old movies or many ISFP writers hiding twisted version of biographical stuff in their stories. There will also be sporadic, Ni-like mysteriousness though, and of course moral concerns, authenticity etc. at the core often, like in INFPs. If Lynch is ISFP I guess there would have to be some kind of art style of type of painting that he is building on, even when making movies? I've heard things to that effect, but I don't really know his influences or paintings well enough to tell if it's a Extraverted Sensing-like relationship he has to them ...
Are you trying to say that INFPs are more shallow than INFJs and ISFPs? Cause that is just funny.
He movies aren't as deep as some make them out to be, he is very shallow and self obsessed like kurt cobain ( also infp ).
Mullhoand Dr for instance hes just bitching abou being a true artist and complaining about hollywood's way of making movies.
Just because he's not gay doesn't mean he's not an INFP. You people should open your minds a little more.
I don't think being iresponsible is N tough, as many homeless alcoholics people are there. Anyway I find #butterfly comment that I don't wanna agree with her weird since I did agreed with Myazaki, Mann and later even Gaiman, and I never managed to sway her not once from what I know, so it's really unfair for her to say that...
*things, patterns, song lyrics
Does anybody knows how an ISFPs artistic process works like? Do they think what story they want to make and than they take or add thinks from the basic premises untill it suits their own artistic sensibilities? Like I imagine a SP musician jamming based on some old patterbs and ending up with something sounding completely new from there. Because Lynch seems very in his own mind.Than again there are ISP musicians that compose sobg lyrics or music in their mind first.But a movie script seems more complex than that.
And he is not sx/sp. Just like Speed Gavroche posted on the french side he values comfort, peace of mind and tranquility way too much to be sx/sp. He also lacks the intensity of an sx in person. So my vote is for 4w5 sp/sx.
Huh, these are good points ...
Lynch was lazy (not about Eraserhead, I just meant to say that he was not productive as you would expect an ISFP filmmaker to be). He was living his life the way he wanted, not in touch at all with the real world. His father and brother had to come to him and tell him to get a job because he had to support his wife and newly born daughter. He did not realise what were his responsibilities until then. ISFPs however abstract they can be are more grounded than that. And when he makes a movie like Inland Empire, shoots it himself with a pd 150 (very poor dv cam), he does not care about the quality of the image that much, but enjoys the freedom to make little movies on his own. So I have a hard time thinking he cares more about the aesthetics of his work than about the impression it gives overall. Also he can be so erratic at times. The way he dreamed up the ending of Blue Velvet is also pretty intuitive. Not saying ISxP can't be intuitive creators as well though.
This is a guy who put his hand on a hot car and he immediately imagined The Red Room. I personally have things like that quite often. Don't how an ISFPs imagination actually works, but if an ISFP can have this kind of instant imagination, I wasted my time beign an INFP.
From what I understand what was hindering Lynch from finishing the movie was lack of money, not laziness. You could turn it around and say taking 8 years is evidence of his perseverance, suggesting SP. Also I think the way he talks about ideas in all his quotes, as lightbulb moments you look for, sounds very Ni. Anyway, ISFP David Lynch got me thinking. We have INFJs as weird as Lars von Trier and Marilyn Manson, who upset people on purpose. Couldn't there theoretically be ISFJs like this? What would an artistic, anti-social ISFJ look like? Or does the conservatism of Si hinder the possibility? Not saying Lynch is ISFJ, but it got me thinking ... Maybe someone we think is INFP or something out there is actually a dark ISFJ.
I agree with everything Bob said. And the quote about details is actually very Si, not Se. Read his autobio, it's all about "fishing" ideas, nothing concrete in there. The simple fact that it took 8 years for him to make eraserhead, not to mention is laziness is just so un-SP.
Omg, bobnickmad. I always feel like my friends, relatives, etc. don't really know me, but with that single insight I feel like you have looked directly into my soul!! You know there are plenty of people I still think are INFP though. :) And nooo, I don't think Lynch is too much weird to be an ISFP. It's certainly not usual, but his weirdness is always on the surface level. At the end of the day he is a very visual director (who cares little about meaning, etc.), draws, paints and makes music while just taking in good faith a type of meditation that supposedly can hinder natural catastrophes if enough people do it, affecting the aura of the environment or something. Doesn't really sound like a person living in ideas (N).
Don't you feel he's too much weird all the time to be ISFP tough. Also, butterfly probably want she and Refn to remain the only INFPs on the planet, because it's a match made in heaven or something!
I wonder if it would hurt Bobnickmad to admit I'm right at least ~once in a while~ about my weird typings. :P
"As a teenager, I was really trying to have fun 24 hours a day. I didn't start thinking until I was 20 or 21. I was doing regular goof-ball stuff."
"To give a sense of place, to me, is a thrilling thing. And a sense of place is made up of details. And so the details are incredibly important. If they're wrong, then it throws you out of the mood. And so the sound and music and color and shape and texture, if all those things are correct and a woman looks a certain way with a certain kind of light and says the right word, you're gone, you're in heaven. But it's all the little details." So Se+Ni it's unbearable. Lynch is basically the Feeler version of Kubrick. CelebrityTypes thinks he is INFP, this place thinks he is INFJ, but actually he is ISFP.
Oh God. This is way too funny. I'll stop posting here, I promise.
He wouldn't kill a fly. Or a butterfly.
Murakami and David Lynch are also very different in person. Murakami is unassuming, warm, funny and wise. David Lynch is somewhat imposing and strange. I would be surprised if they were the same type actually.
I think that's a very technical, minor point to topple my otherwise successful line of reasoning!! Also I've actually heard something similar about writer Karl Ove Knausgård (ISFP). He obsessively chews Juicy Fruit bubblegum. He can't write or think without it. Se users might need something like that to concentrate, a specific sensory thing, like Lynch has his chocolate milk because their senses are otherwise so sensitive. I can't explain other diets he has though? Maybe if there was more information about his food habits. As for Lynch and Murakami; I think they are incredibly different. Murakami, whether he is INFP or INFJ, is heavily concerned with society and community even when he tells us not to care. His surrealism also carries a lot more meaning. Lynch, on the other hand, is very "art for art's sake" and his surrealism is often just plain "take it or leave it" weirdness. Finally, it's not just Lynch's hair. It's the poses and everything. He knows how to look cool and nearly always pulls of some kind of self-conscious elegant pose, just like Camus or Knausgård (alleged ISFPs). I'm an 4w5 too and I don't look half as cool as David Lynch!! :P
Well played Buttefly,but... Yeah, you forgot one essential aspect discussed below: his love for routine. Which can be explained with... regimented tertiary Si. Meanwhile it's makes no sense with a SP. ''This goes Lynch is a notorious creature of habit: he spent seven years drinking the same chocolate milkshake at the same time every day from Bob’s Big Boy in L.A.'' SP are about being exploratory when it comes to the senses, but Si, even lower Si is bound to same kind of routine or another. ''When I ask why he wants to stick to this redundant diet, he tells me that it's 'reassuring . . . there are no surprises there' ''. Bam! He explained it somewhere better, by sticking to a routine, he can leave his mind freely to day-dream. Same thing Murakami. Ne-Si combo. Si finds comfort in routine, and Ne imagination is left to wonder in all directions without being distracted by the every day 'surprises'. The similarity is easy explained by both Lynch and Murakami being Ne-Si INFPs, not ISFP and INFJ. In fact why do you need different types for them when they're so similar in the first place? As for Lynch looking bad-ass... I understand that with Camus or Johny Depp, but Lynch? Really, because he has 'cool' hair or something? His look is 4w5, not Se, definitely not bad-ass. Anyway, SP=/=regimented routine. *Drops Mic!*
A true bunch of mental masturbators.
Everyone=ISFP is doing the Lord's work here. Bless you :)
Your last two arguments sealed the deal. Rest was all rubbish. When confused between ISFP and INFP, always look for signs on "sack of potatoes" - Works 100%...
Don't take my picture though!! Baka.
David Lynch is absolutely NO sack of potatoes INFP!
Another argument: Google "Nicolas Winding Refn" or "Tim Burton", and google "David Lynch". Nicholas Winding Refn = Looks like a sack of potatoes (Tertiary Si), might have a playful smile (Ne). Tim Burton = Looks like a sack of potatoes (Tertiary Si) and somewhat gloomy (Fi). David Lynch = Badass motherfucker (Se). :P
To explain the Dennis Hopper thing more closely: Lynch basically allowed himself to be corrected for realism (Se). Another argument: Note that Lynch is famous for weird stuff, like peeing on set in front of everyone (not kidding). I don't see an INFP being that relaxed about their body. On the other hand I can imagine an ISFP ...
Of course bobnickmad is another peasant like you. He argues his case, unlike MBTI master who just know things...
Just an anecdote I could never put together about Lynch which I think suddenly makes sense now that I think he's ISFP. Apparently, in Blue Velvet, Lynch wanted Dennis Hopper to breathe in helium when he calls for his mommy and whatever in those really weird scenes. Dennis Hopper, who didn't know what helium did to your voice, asked Lynch why he would be breathing helium when other gasses make you feel a lot better. So Lynch simply changed it another gas. Later Hopper found out what helium does to your voice and he regretted his suggestion. The anecdote went something like that. I think if Lynch was INFP would had been like, "Who cares? It's going to be so weird and awesome." (Ne) Personally I'm sad whenever I think of that, because I think it would had been so cool. Because Lynch is an ISFP, he allowed himself to be corrected (Se).
@butterfly: every typology genius know ISFPs are very plain, have simple ideas and use easy words. I insist you listen to these MBTI masters and enlighten yourself.
@Kami-samaaa: If you read lots of my posts, I definitely don't claim everyone is an ISFP. But I think ISFPs are systematically underestimated, among other reasons because most people seem to lack an extensive understanding of Se and Tertiary Ni - and what it can do and does. Taking this into account, and the fact that ISFPs are statistically a lot more common than INFJs, INFPs and INTJs, it shouldn't come as a surprise that many "deep" and unusual artists are in fact ISFPs. Another thing is that few ISFPs are interested in MBTI, or very good at it, and can thus defend themselves. I, for one, am actually INFP myself.
You've definitely studied him a lot closer in terms of MBTI than I have, so there's that. I also think that either you are underestimating what an ISFP can do (in terms of starting out with surrealism, etc.) or I am overestimating what an ISFP can do. Since INFP seems completely off to me, and I don't think he is INFJ, I'm prone to concluding that you are underestimating, lol. Looking at this painting and comparing it to Winding Refn-sama's style, I still feel that Lynch could very well be Se. When you look at those paintings, even though the motives are surreal, there is a sort of earthy evenness to their beauty (Se). Compare to for example the aesthetic of, yes, Winding Refn-sama's Drive. At first glance, the movie looks positively wacky. There is all the weird colors, interesting details in the background, etc., etc. http://afistfulofculture.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/drive-still03.jpg http://somamagazine.com/site/wp-content/uploads/drive-DRV-01381_rgb.jpg https://projectedperspectives.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/tumblr_lzfscqpiqm1rob9suo1_1280.jpg It's like Winding Refn has been going, "Let's do that ... And let's do that ... And let's do that and that and that." You see the same striking, wacky visuals in presumed INFP directors like Tim Burton. I also think Drive is not the best comparison as he's playing with a very specific type of film (though I definitely there is some heavy intuition stuff going on with the hero origin story it's supposed to be), but if you look at more Lynchian movies like Neon Demon and Valhalla Rising, I definitely think Winding Refn-sama is more purpose-laden and conscious of what things are supposed to mean and do, and how he is developing them (Ne+Te) rather than the "take it or leave it" way I feel Lynch does it. For example in Neon Demon different character function as metaphors for different powers in the beauty industry. In comparison, from what I understand Mulholland Drive actually has a "sensible" story that can be solved by reflection and Lynch has even given hints? It's just been scrambled? Also I feel Lynch's depiction of small town life may just as well be a Se thing. Wouldn't Si be more nostalgic about it? The evil hiding just under the surface sounds Se+Ni to me above all.
Butterfly is giving everyone a nice good lesson. Sit down and take notes. Lynch is ISFP and Butterfly will teach you why.
Butterfly what is your problem? You are a ISFP who wants everyone to be ISFP or is it just a troll?
Butterfly what is your problem? You are a ISFP who wants everyone to be ISFP or is it just a troll?
Anyway, the thing that is very clear is that his infj-ness is only on surface level. For an INFJ not to have developed his Ti enough to interpret his own works, it would mean his Fe would be very developed but that's not the case, he's not very emotionally articulate, and if FJs are one thing, it's emotionally articulate. There's an interview with Charlie Rose about Straight Story, and he really struggles to explain what is that attracted him to the story. ''It's a feeling that the story gives'' but really not good at making that feeling understood. INFJ may be peculiar in their intuition, but their feeling is extraverted, it find itself in other's emotions, it connects with it, and as such is good at explaining itself to someone else.Not Lynch tough.That said, I don't think this lack of being very articulated in interviews necessary makes him SP, as INFPs can find verbal expression difficult, NFJ not so much.It's more the lack of Se aesthetic in his more personal projects ('paintings' or short movies) that makes it clear for me. Also, the fact that he has this thing with the world hidden behind the real world, the meeting of the normal and the bizzare, the journey in a weird world hidden behind the surface, strikes me very INFP.
Your post about him being ISFP made me more sure about him being INFP :) (in the sense that I still can't see Eraserhead ISFP, lol). I mean, if we look at someone like Bob Dylan or Stanley Kubrick we see that before they got into weirdness they were rather conventional. Bob Dylan was just a folk-singer with really plain simple lyrics with no intention of being original, then I realized he had to become his own person, read lots of books and somehow this lead to Desolation Row. Similar with Kubrick with conventional movies like The Kill before going 2001 and stuff.But Lynch started weird. Anyway, I know this isn't a convincing argument, so look at his paintings: https://www.google.ro/search?q=david+lynch+paintings&biw=1024&bih=602&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjw0tSJs6zNAhXMtBQKHd-MBkMQ_AUIBigB#imgrc=WsjGtOi-ao0fTM%3A Where is Se in there. Se, even coupled with Ni has a certain conventional aesthetic that lacks completely from his 'paintings'.Unlike his movies, the sensuality is taken out from there, instead they are unsettling on a visceral level, in a way that suggest an unhealthy low Si to me (Si being interiorized sensation, opposed to extroverted one). Of course, for a long movie like Blue Velvet or Mulholland Dr., you need a more conventional, Se like aesthetic, but I don't think INFPs lack in aesthetics sensibilities department either. For example, your beloved Refn and Drive. Don't you think on the surface, Drive looks very Se ? There's not much to the movie in terms of themes or stuff, it's just a very simple story but it looks gorgeous, with an excellent eye for visuals, sound and atmosphere, as you can find in Blue Velvet or Mulholland Dr. So, if Refn can do a movie like Drive and not be ISP, so can Lynch. Yet, when you look at the stuff he does completely without restrictions, like his weird short movies or those things he calls paintings, the Se like aesthetics are lacking. I do agree that there are some ISFP-ish thing to him, but he wouldn't be the first INFP with an appreciation for visuals or sound. That and I also see a more conventional Si aspect to him, in his idealization of small town life and comparing it to the ''corruption'' he later found. There's also the quote I posted about how one of his paintings is a serene image of his childhood but ''darkness has crept in''.
Okay, so I've finally taken the time to take a careful look at David Lynch, and I come out absolutely convinced that he is an ISFP. In an earlier post Bobnickmad says that he could imagine Lynch as an ISFP if it weren't for Eraserhead, which is pure intuition. I disagree though. Actually, Eraserhead is incredibly Se. Lynch did surrealist paintings before he started the movie, and imo this is what the movie first of all reflects: The film itself is all about interesting visuals and audio design, where I remember the latter being especially praised. The metaphor about fatherhood is actually pretty banal (Tertiary Ni). Compare to similar director Nicolas Winding Refn (INFP) who tends to have a lot more complex and developed metaphors. Note also that Eraserhead was Stanley Kubrick's (ISTP) favorite film. I think Lynch has some sort of Tertiary Ni fixation with surrealism. It gives him some kind of spiritual/aesthetic experience. To me, as an INFP, I've always kind of felt unsatisfied with Lynch (except Twin Peaks which is co-written) because I want the weirdness to go somewhere, but it never does. The weirdness is its own statement (Se+Ni). Also note how his movies, when he's not being surreal, tend to be very down-to-earth stories about common life as it is lived (Se). For example the American small towns depicted in Twin Peaks and Blue Velvet in each their way. Lynch is also a musician (Se) and an artist (Se) in addition to directing movies primarily known for being visually interesting (Se). Seems like a lot of Se for both an INFJ and an INFP! Se sort of seems to be where he is at home. Furthermore, note his interest in new age-y stuff like Transcendental Meditation. I think an INFP or INFJ as fulfilled as Lynch would be a bit more intellectually, intuitively sophisticated. Finally, take a look at this interview. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL0Ij89xazA It's basically a Se performance ... How he moves his hands around, how he enunciates the way he speaks, how he is dressed. Also compare his body language to those of INFPs and INFJs. Body language is an unreliable way to type, but I think Lynch seems strikingly ISFP. He has that intense, cool Se/Ni vibe, but at the same time he is clearly not Fe. He is making the person in that interview uncomfortable, lol.
cc is "hello to" oooops
Lynch's work is intense as fuck and also twisted. sx/sp right there for you. Robert Crumb is sx/sp; look at the man and then his work, do they match?
Both of you do not have very convincing argument for either type. The conversation before was interesting though and you could have found answers there. I'm quite puzzled by the loss of quality in discussion on this site. Cooper is not Lynch IMO, as I said before the part of his work that appears INFJ/Ni was co-written. Mark Frost could very well be INTJ. He's not a 5, and he's not sx/sp in my view. He lacks the intensity of an sx/sp.
@fuckboy: "hello to" is always right though, so you must listen.
I guess you are. Consider my mind blown by your superior giftedness.
I see it too clearly. I guess I'm gifted. Sorry about that.
It's just a streak in him. Not saying INFJs are bad. But photos capture that very well. It's like something very dark opens up, but rarely. But Lynch doesn't have that. Never. Only talking about his persona again. That last comment of you makes me think a lot already about INFPs in general. But I see INFJs all the opposite of what you just have said.
If anything, Fi doms appear colder and likely to be "evil" from the outside, while the Fe of INFJs gives a warmer, outwardly kind exterior.
I have no clue what "evilish persona" is or what that has to do wtih INFJ.
Did you understad what I said?
He's def sx/sp
Evilish in his persona, not his movies.
Lynch's work tends to forgo logical cohesiveness to give impressions, which seems like Fe suppressed Ti. And in Enneagram land, something that isn't 5. He doesn't seem to have that "investigator" passion for diving deep into topics, preferring to focus on juxtaposing objects of emotional complexity, to create a dissonant manipulator of the subconscious. That seems very 4 rather than 5, but he still may have a 5 wing.
Lynch doesn't have that evilish streak INFJs show sometimes, among other things I've thought about him. I also have been thinking about split fantasies too; I'm sorry if that sounds too abstract. I only liked some of his movies, instead of liking them all and being a big fan like other mbti types. I find it strange to think of him as INFP being me one. I can't put all my thoughts here because I don't like to write too much.
Supposedly Agent Cooper is based on Lynch himself and he is quite clearly an INFJ and that is what the crowd here unanimously says too...
INFP. I just thought about it for the last 10 minutes. And yes, he's INFP.
https://www.google.ro/search?q=DAVid+lynch+so+this+is+love&biw=1024&bih=602&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj39OKdx4bNAhXI2xoKHYNeDYAQ_AUICCgD#tbm=isch&q=david+lynch+paintings&imgrc=41kW3ObKDgccSM%3A On a side note, I don't think I'm the only one who sees a similarity between his paintings, and that of Kurt Cobain:''https://www.google.ro/search?q=DAVid+lynch+so+this+is+love&biw=1024&bih=602&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj39OKdx4bNAhXI2xoKHYNeDYAQ_AUICCgD#tbm=isch&q=kurt+cobain+paintings''
Part 3:Some other quotes that sounds very INFP: ''I love child things because there's so much mystery when you're a child. When you're a child, something as simple as a tree doesn't make sense. You see it in the distance and it looks small, but as you go closer, it seems to grow – you haven't got a handle on the rules when you're a child. We think we understand the rules when we become adults but what we really experienced is a narrowing of the imagination.'';''I:How old do you feel emotionally? DL: Between 9 and 17 most of the time, and sometimes around six. '''
Part 2:When you take from the equation the Ni bias that comes with Transcendental Meditation which makes him describe his process as quite Ni, and compare with how his actual process is, it actually sounds more like his main drive is again, feeling tones that come to him in fragments.Like for example Blue Velvet, come from the image of an ear in the grass, then he heard one of the song that is played the movies, and all kinds of images that eventually set the overall mood.Also, similar with what I pointed could be Fi-Si below, Blue Velvet seems mainly to be about his idylic childhood and the contrast with the dark side of society he found out later. Eraserhead seems to be very much like the works of Kafka, strange, surreal metaphors of his own personal anxieties, mainly that of being a father.He also said that his movies aren't about a social message, which seems odd for an NFJ.In a way, it would be more easy to see him as an ISFP than an INFJ.But while I can see an ISFP adding strong intuition to his movies (sort of like Blue Velvet), I can't see an ISFP making Eraserhead as a debut film.The whole movie is intuition from start to finish.Or his weird mini movies, like The Alphabet which seem pure abstractions.In this interview you can also see he's philosophical on a very wide range of subjects, while an ISFP would be philosophical in a more restricted way I'd say:http://www.thecityofabsurdity.com/intpaint.html
Musing on Lynch,Part 1: #randomguy:''Many of his explanation is more of a personal impression based on sensory experience which suggests Fi and Si.'' That's an interesting point. DL:''Inspiration is like a piece of fuzz – it kind of comes up and makes a desire and an image that causes me to want to paint it. Or I can be going along and see an old Band-Aid in the street, and you know how an old Band-Aid is. It's got some dirt around the edges and the rubber part has formed some black little balls. and you see the stain of a little and maybe some yellow dirt on it, a little ointment. It's in the gutter next to some dirt and a rock, and maybe a little twig. If you were to see a photograph of that not knowing what it was, it would be unbelievably beautiful.''Putting aside how strange it is, it seems like what is of real interest for David Lynch is feeling tones (Fi). INFJ can also have personal aesthetics, but it wouldn't be so unconventional I think, their feelings tones would still have something of what's appreciated in the culture they live in (Fe), while for Lynch it's individualized and...weird.Sort of like the movie Stalker by Tarkovsky, for the most it's just footage of dirty water and industrial decay, but it's filmed with such an unique sensitivity that it makes more than all the symbolism in the world.This reminds me when a school psychology counselor (who was also a philosophy teacher, either INFJ or ISFJ) asked me what I like about me, and I answered ''I can see beauty in everything''. Of course that's not really true, but the point I was trying to make is very similar to how Lynch sees the world I think.Further proof of how individualized his feeling tones are:''Different paintings would have different sounds. So This Is Love, would have a muffled sound like talking through a glove. A Bug Dreams would be a really shrill 15.000 cycle piercing sound, She Wasn't Fooling Anyone, She Was Hurt Bad would be an extremely slow motion, muffled breaking glass sound.''There also seems to be a Fi-Si thing going one with his weird imagery, talking about a painting: ''Interviewer:One of your recent paintings, "So This Is Love", seems to take a fairly dark view of love. The image centers on a lone figure with impossibly long legs that elevate his head into bleak empty space. An airplane splutters by his head pumping smoke into the night sky; can you talk a bit about this piece. DL:It's like a negative image of my childhood. In reality that sky would've been blue and Technicolor and the plane would've been a large military plane that made a droning sound. The plane took a long time to cross the sky and the sound it made was very serene. The world seemed to be more quiet when the plane was passing through the sky. I:This is a pleasant memory for you, yet you've translated it into a dark image; why? DL:Because darkness has crept in since then. The darkness is realizations about the world and human nature and my own nature all combined into one ball of sludge.''
I changed my vote to INFP. Overall, I think he's far too erratic to be INFJ. He's close to Robert Altman in a way, and I now think the part of his work which seems Ni was actually co-written. Mark Frost was the brain of Twin Peaks (He wrote, directed and produced on his own the last episodes of the first season of the show because Lynch left to do Wild at Heart, and they are amazing), Lost Highway was co-written by Barry Gifford. The difference between this movie and Mullholand Drive (Lynch alone) may be the answer. The first is very Ni, convergent, while the second is a puzzle. Eraserhead, the final of Twin peaks improvised, the ending sequence of Blue Velvet dreamed the day before the shooting, the chaotic Inland Empire...All that feels more Ne. But he's complex for his type, whatever it may be.
"Intuition receives from the sensation only the impetus to immediate activity; it peers behind the scenes, quickly perceiving the inner image that gave rise to the specific phenomenon. It sees the image of a tottering man pierced through the heart by an arrow. This image fascinates the intuitive activity; it is arrested by it, and seeks to explore every detail of it. It holds fast to the vision, observing with the liveliest interest how the picture changes, unfolds further, and finally fades. In this way introverted intuition perceives all the background processes of consciousness with almost the same distinctness as extraverted sensation senses outer objects. For intuition, therefore, the unconscious images attain to the dignity of things or objects. The images appear as though detached from the subject, as though existing in themselves without relation to the person." <--------- This is exactly how Lynch 's cognitive process works in my opinion. He often described his creative flow as catching a fragment of a puzzle; and that the whole image exists somewhere in "an another room" and his aim is to let the puzzle fragment lead him to other fragments until he can finally reassemble the whole.
I went back to his autobiography, but to be fair it's too "contaminated" by meditation talk. He keeps on stating the same things: "dive deeper", "down deep", "all within", "to go towards the source to catch the ideas like fish", "I like the feeling of discovery, going deeper". Ideas appear to him almost magically though. His attitude about sex might be a key: “Sex is a doorway to something so powerful and mystical, but movies usually depict it in a completely flat way.” He also has lots of sexual tension in his films (that I associated with the ESTP characters), voyeurism (Blue Velvet) and erotic photo work (not always of the best taste) that could relate more to inferior Se than Si.
I don't think INFJs would be that good with imposed routine either (ESTJ shadow is not that far from ESTP when it comes to this point). Especially if they're both 4s. I'm unsure of what I think of his type now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Fw6TxwwnYQ#t=97 I see well composed Ti in the way he expresses himself, chooses his words carefully.
I don't have it with me right now but I will try to find out some quotes when I can. On another hand, I remember that he dreamed the blue velvet ending (which eluded him until then) the night before the shooting. It reminded me of Robert Altman, who was most certainly INFP.
Also: @thedude I haven't read his autobiography. Could you share a few excerpts from it that point toward INFJ?
*meaning of his work, not meaning meaning
@randomguy - Yes, I agree with your observations. Additionally, if Lynch's Ne is less obvious than his Si, that could explain why he is more routine-bound than most INFPs. @thedude - yes, Ni in isolation is highly abstract, cryptic, symbolic, etc. but it is also a synthesizer that weaves together divergent symbols/thoughts into a unified whole. INFPs on the other hand use Ne to translate their Fi, which can often cause pseudo-Ni-domness in product (see also: Terrence Malick, Andrei Tarkovsky) but without the convergent, unified nature of a true Ni-dom's work, instead being more free-associative, multifaceted, and nebulous. Also since Ni is a synthesizer, it does tend to form a clearer picture of the film's overall meaning by default, and to suggest otherwise is to move the goalposts. Not saying it would be impossible for a Ni-Dom to not care about the meaning meaning, but you'd have to explain why at an individual level. As for almost always having ESTP villains, that's interesting but also correlation without causation. Put it this way: if he had INFJ villains but acted the same way, would you consider ESTP for him? I doubt it.
Also I think I should mention that the interest in meditation or transcendentalism isn't something exclusive to Ni users.
Not sure about his type yet, but I've watched some of his interviews and he didn't quite strike me as Ni user, as he seemed to struggle to explain his thought process when being asked, which seemed like the lack of Ti in the stack. Many of his explanation is more of a personal impression based on sensory experience which suggests Fi and Si. Although I didn't see much of his Ne besides his habits of fragmenting his thoughts and ideas while he talked. Also his quotes from @Ventus413's comments convinced me that he's heavily Fi. I voted INFP.
Actually none of this is contradictory to being Ni dom. Ni dom are known to spontaneously create art that comes from the collective unconscious. The need to understand and explain their vision comes from tertiary Ti which is not developped with Lynch (which makes him look a bit childish compared to more mature and cynical INFJ males). I would not give any credit to an artist saying he does not want to explain his work. Ni dom are often cryptic. It's like typing someone ISFP because he doesn't care about the meaning of his work (something Celebrity Types should learn). I think his Fe is visible in interviews. And nothing in these quotes cotradicts INFJ. Being attentive to details, especially when it relates to a mood, or not be willing to impose your view on things is not necessarily Si+Fi. He also likes routine. His work is filled with ESTP vilains. Rather than interviews, have you read his autobiography? I think it's the best way to find out his type.
"It makes me uncomfortable to talk about meanings and things. It's better not to know so much about what things mean. Because the meaning, it's a very personal thing, and the meaning for me is different than the meaning for somebody else." "To give a sense of place, to me, is a thrilling thing. And a sense of place is made up of details. And so the details are incredibly important. If they're wrong, then it throws you out of the mood. And so the sound and music and color and shape and texture, if all those things are correct and a woman looks a certain way with a certain kind of light and says the right word, you're gone, you're in heaven. But it's all the little details." Fi and Si, and nothing to do with Transcendental Meditation. Also, in order to say that other quote suggests INFJ + Transcendental Meditation rather than INFP +Transcendental Meditation, you need to explain how... I see no reason why it fits INFJ + TM better than INFP + TM or even INFP without TM....
He couldn't shill for Transcendental Meditation® if he said anything else.
Lynch: "It's better not to know so much about what things mean or how they might be interpreted or you'll be too afraid to let things keep happening. Psychology destroys the mystery, this kind of magic quality. It can be reduced to certain neuroses or certain things, and since it is now named and defined, it's lost its mystery and the potential for a vast, infinite experience." Fi-Ne, not Ni-Dom. Also if you think his films are the epitome of INFJ, I'd suggest watching The Elephant Man, which strikes me as the epitome of Fi.
INFJ is actually the most 4-ish type out there though, and I do agree with your perception of him. He's an INFJ 4
He talks about ideas as if they're a fragment of a greater whole that he is trying to reassemble like a puzzle. He's indeed a dominant perceiver, Ni.
Kant, by the way, I've seen typed as a J before...
Yeah, I'm tired of people using "tertiary" and "inferior" functions as a magic wand to explain away inconsistencies. Going by function logic alone, in INxPs Ne dominates Si. Si is weak, it is poor, it is not comfortable for them. According to some interpretations of the functions, the two lowest functions - Si and Te in this case - are in fact the two worst, weakest functions. They are, after all, the total opposites of the two strongest, most dominant functions. So no, if you think someone is any kind of xNxP and then you notice them following a strict routine you should probably reconsider their type. Lynch perfectly fits the Ni type as described by Jung anyway, both in his art and in his personal life (meditation). Every interview and quote I have seen of his backs it up. And his idea of morality (represented by the "black and white lodge" in Twin Peaks) seems to be more objective (Fe) too, not to mention he tends to be big on social harmony and politeness over individual moral values.
Yeah his movies are the epitome of INFJ
Thanks shahenshah, great video! If this isn't Ni then what is it? :p I also recommend watching videos where he explains transcendental meditation, there are a couple on youtube!
I'll add this link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fxr-7O1Bfxg The analogy leaned me a lot more towards INFJ but most of his interviews it skips down the middle of INFP and INFJ. But I'm still undecided. I'm just putting this forward to help the discussion if it does.
Kant (INTP) followed an incredibly strict routine/agenda. It's possible for INxPs to very regimented. Still, I'm not sure what Lynch is.
I'm really surprised about all the INFP votes. He might be one of the clearest example of INFJs I can think of. All the functions are very well represented in both his works and in his real life. He is an adept of meditation and find all his ideas in his subconscious that he loves to explore; once he falls in love with an idea he follows it until the end with a strong focus that can last for several years. All of his works are about the worlds within us, the "everything is possible", "everything is a dream", finding deeper meanings and symbols all around. Most of the villains in his fictions are ESTPs, and the character the most "personal" according to him is Dale Cooper, an archetypal INFJ. In real life he is known to have strict schedules that he follows, be extremely socially friendly (to the point of over-politeness), to be very good at hosting/receiving friends for lunch etc. He is a very healthy INFJ, no Ni-Ti loop here, every function is well developed. I love him!
Although I still think there should be more discussion. Discussion is always good.
Even though he has a strict routine INFPs have a tertiary Si which is big on routine.
OK, I agree Lynch is INFJ, but I do NOT condone rigging votes. There is no way INFP legitimately goes from winning by a relatively small margin forever to INFJ crushing it so quickly. And I have noticed this trend on A LOT of other pages as well. This site does not get enough traffic that fast, especially not individual pages. Some kind of account verification is needed to prevent cheating.
I thought INFP for the longest time, but now I think INFJ. Apparently he follows a very strict routine everyday. Everything is done according to schedule and at the same time every day, including his meditation. He also ate the same lunch every day at the same time at the same place for several years. He says he likes external orderly structure for things in his life and it actually helps his creativity. Plus, he is not as impulsive or aimless as one may think, even with his films. People he have worked with, actors, executives, etc., all say that he has a very strong, clear vision planned out ahead of time and knows exactly what to do to fulfill it and follows through. They all unanimously claim he is highly reliable, responsible and conscientious. He is also apparently extremely polite and mature. I'm going to have to say he is definitely INFJ. Even seems to fit with the functions better than INFP. Plus, it would seem fitting since all his "good" characters (like Cooper) seem to be INFJs and all his "evil" characters (like Frank Booth) seem to be ESTP. Fits with the whole shadow motif.
Ohhhh, so David Lynch is what an INFP 5 looks like. I always wondered. Now my thoughts are laid to rest.
Je suis aussi surpris de voir Lynch typé INFP, comme Jim Morrison d'ailleurs. Il me semble tout à fait INFJ. Il faut dire que sa personnalité est plus lumineuse que ses films. Il y a aussi cet aspect purement instinctif du NI dominant qui puise dans l’Inconscient Collectif, sans avoir jamais lu un livre de psychanalyse. On retrouve souvent l’axe INFJ/ESTP dans ses films d’ailleurs. Son attitude vis à vis de la sexualité est aussi très SE inférieur à mon sens. Avec son côté sage maître zen, il n’est pas très éloigné d’un Jodorowsky dans le fond.
Ni dom sans le moindre doute. Je suis assez surpris des résultats le donnant Fi (étant moi-même INFP). Il trouve son inspiration dans son monde intérieur qui est indépendant de lui même, il l'explore comme il explore le monde réel. C'est un fort signe de Ni. Chez les INFPs le monde intérieur n'existe pas "par lui même", c'est la création de l'INFP, c'est lui-même, son idéal.
il est plus tourné vers le confort et la sécurité, il a pas le coté impulsif et intense des Sx/Sp.
Ses films ne "font" pas INFP, toujours INJ-INTP (Blue Velvet, Eraserhead par exemple); il n'y a pas de traces de "Fi", plutôt celles de quelqu'un observant "Fe", avec des lunettes pour le moins.. intuitives. Mais lui en revanche semble INFP. INFP, 5w4, sp/sx. Mais "so" pas inexistant pour autant.
Pourquoi plus Sp que Sx ?
INFP 5w4 Sp/Sx, Exil m'a convaincu. (waah, l'exploit!)
Freud aussi présupposait que les rêves étaient délibérément cryptés (rapport aux tabous), mais en fait ils sont simplement l'expression authentique du langage que parle l'inconscient, à savoir symbolique. C'est à nous de retrouver cette forme de compréhension intuitive, inhérente à la créativité, pour en interpréter le sens comme il se doit.
ça m'arrive de parler de Lynch pendant des heures.
Simplement parce que je m'y retrouve, et que beaucoup de mes extrapolations sur Ni s'y trouve illustrées. Je te renvoi à une discution que j'avais eu sur le forum avec une autre INFJ (Stella) il y a un moment déjà : http://mbti.forumactif.fr/t289p60-identifier-le-type-d-une-personne-a-partir-d-une-interview
Infj parce que c'est souvent abstrait ?
Ses films font carrément INFJ (si je puis me permettre), mais en ITW, c'est vrai qu'il a plutôt l'air FP (mais pas forcément Ne, raison pour laquelle - je crois - certains n'hésitent pas à le ranger de force chez les ISFP...)
Je vais dire INFP. J'ai vu Lost Highway. Ce film est vraiment symbolique et abstrait! Je me demande vraiment comment on peut y voir du S dominant.
Il se préoccupe de l'esthétisme de ses VISIONS symboliques, ce qui est typique de l'artiste IN, dont le principal soucis est de pouvoir contempler sensoriellement, ce qu'il a d'abord entrevu intuitivement... (le ISFP étant un artiste qui travaille à même la matière, à la façon d'un sculpteur, ou d'un danseur. Son art est impulsif/instinctif, avec un engagement sensoriel notable et inhérent au processus créatif)
ouais, c'est ça.